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Terry Dresbach




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by Julie Kosin, August 29, 2016

The show’s costume designer and production designer—who just so happen to be real-life best friends—open up about bringing the book series to life.

In Season 2 of Outlander, time-traveling heroine Claire Fraser (Caitriona Balfe) journeys through the 18th century, from the French court of King Louis XV to the Scottish Highlands, to 1940s (and later, ’60s) Scotland. Sounds like a daunting task for any design department, right? Not when your production designer and costume designer have been best friends and collaborators for nearly 30 years. Instead, you get a veritable smorgasbord of lavish costumes and intricate sets that tell their own stories—as well as Emmy nominations aplenty. Here, HarpersBAZAAR.com chats with Jon Gary Steele, Outlander‘s production designer, and Terry Dresbach, the show’s costume designer (and wife of its showrunner, Ronald D. Moore) to discuss their collaboration, designing accurately through different time periods and dealing with fan reactions to one of the most popular shows on television:

Harper’s BAZAAR: How do your teams collaborate to create the feel of the show?

Terry Dresbach: Gary and I have been best friends for, I hate to say, almost 30 years. I know him better than maybe I know my own husband in some ways. Creatively he’s like my twin. We confer a bit—”What color is that wall” or “What color is that dress?”—but we’re always linked creatively.

Jon Gary Steele: We actually think alike. If we’re walking the streets we’ll both notice the same thing. We always show each other as many colors of what we’re doing in advance. In Paris especially, everything was discussed. We were going for deep, dark rich colors for the walls and things like that, so her costumes would pop off. The first year we couldn’t use red because Ron [Moore, Outlander showrunner] wanted the Redcoats to be only red. It’s all thought-out and talked about.

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HB: Are pieces of the sets echoed in the costumes?

TD: Always. Gary and I take vacations together and road trips. I make him chocolate cookies and he brings over a giant stack of design magazines. It doesn’t matter whether its fashion design or interiors, we’re both going, “Oh my God, look at that color.” I’ll open my email and be like, “You’ve got to see this image from Elle Décor ” or “I just saw this dress or this piece of jewelry,” so we’re always in sync. Those little pieces get echoed. I’ll walk on a set and go, “That looks like that jewelry piece you showed me last month.” Or he’ll go, “There’s that fabric color you were talking about.” It’s always threading through everything we do together.

JGS: I noticed there was a scene in Jamie and Claire’s bedroom and Claire was wearing some kind of metallic thing that was like a chain. It was a very old, ancient thing and it went from one part of her chest down to a little pocket, and Jamie has these buttons on the coat he was wearing. They’re sitting by the fireplace in this chair that had studs all up and down the sides. The fire was hitting the studs and his buttons and this piece of chain that she had on. We discussed it later; it was like it was all planned. We’re all trying to achieve the same magical thing and it does happen a lot.

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HB: Gary, is there ever a time you have to make sacrifices in authenticity for the sake of filming?

JGS: Most of the time Ron wants it to feel as real and authentic as possible. Especially Season 1. When we did the first year, we did tons of research on the stones. It was so much easier to build our own stones. I hear stories all the time from people who live in the area trying to find those standing stones. I’m like, “Well, keep looking.” I wanted to put the stones up in a grove on a hill. Everyone was getting annoyed with me, and the director, John Dahl, said, “Gary, we could put it down there in the middle of that field and make everyone’s life 1,000 times easier. You’re making this really difficult!” So we get back to the office and he says, “Why are you insistent that this be in a grove on a hill when it would be so much easier to film in a field?” And I said, “Because this is the magic of this show. When you read the book, this is the one place. You shouldn’t see it from miles away. You have to work your way up and see little glimpses of it. You should get chills on your arms when you see pieces of it coming through. It’s the only thing that’s really mystical and magical. And he said, “You got your way, get out of my office.” Everybody gets it when you need it to be magical. He came up to me after we filmed it, with the women dancing around with the torches, and he said, “You were right. It worked.”

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HB: What were the highlights of Season 2 for you both?

JGS: I’m a huge Francophile. It’s a dream to get to design 18th-century Paris sets because it’s one of the most decadent periods of time. It’s amazing for art, architecture, fashion, landscape architecture—everything. The best set to me was King Louis’s Star Chamber. Ron let me go a little over the top with it. The scripts just say it’s a mystical, magical space where the king leads Claire for this judgement thing. It was during a time of enlightenment, so people were interested in science and astrology and astronomy and witchcraft. We know from researchthe king dabbled in some of this. So we covered all the walls with 16th-century alchemy symbols and etchings that we found. I kept finding these amazing images of domes from ancient times throughout the world and a lot of them were pierced with little circles or stars that light would come through and land on the floor. When Claire walked through it, I wanted to have these little shafts of light cross her face and torso. I think the most response I got from anything was from that set. Even the actors were jumping up and down when they walked in, going, “Oh my God! This is fun!” And of course those crazy poisonous snakes. Usually I’m the one that asks for crazy stuff so when I heard there were going to be poisonous snakes I’m like, “Really? They’re gonna think I asked for this.”

Then we had the brothel, which was a hoot. I wanted to make the wall panels pierced so you could see the prostitutes taking men to the doors through the screens. It was supposed to be a very decadent place where Bonnie Prince Charlie would hang out. He’s royalty, he wouldn’t go to some sleazebag place. In our research, we found these underground clubs—I think one of them was in London, called the Hellcat Club—where men would do alchemy and magic and hire prostitutes. It sounds like this period was even more risqué than what we thought it was. The rich were really, really rich and they flaunted it. Sometimes it’s hard to show that kind of wealth but that’s what we were going for. We were trying to show the complete opposite of Scotland, which was much more utilitarian—just enough to get by.

TD: The French court was one of the real reasons I wanted to do the show. My whole career—my whole life—I wanted to do 18th-century France and now I’m like, “Done that! We’re good.” I’ve never been so glad to get out. I kind of poo-pooed Scotland. The kilt wasn’t a big thing for me. But I just fell in love with the Scottish stuff. There’s a subtlety and a richness and a depth to the textures. The way we tried to interpret nature in our Scottish costumes, they became something so unexpected. When you’re recreating Paris you can go as big as you want and you can be spectacular and beautiful, but you’re still creating something we all know. There’s millions of paintings. There’s clothes that still exist. But there’s a freedom to Scotland, a creative freedom that’s just magnificent. We’ve gotten really experimental. We’re painting all sorts of things and playing with textures and fabric treatments and it’s really exciting work. There’s no blueprint to follow but you have to remain true. When the show moves forward there’s a truth that we have to interpret but we get to interpret it and it’s exciting.

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HB: Terry, tell me about that Swan Dress.

TD: The dress is an incredibly dramatic piece. What I tried to do with that dress was almost upstage the exposed nipples with the gloriousness of that dress. I’ve never done an adaptation before, but what I’ve learned is that people build so much anticipation into certain pieces. The Swan dress, the red dress, the wedding dress. They become pored over in detail so that when they come out, you can never match that expectation. Whereas the brown dress with the flowers on it, the Dior dress, Jamie’s coat with the deer stag. The fans didn’t have any way of anticipating them, so when they came out they were like, “Whoa!” When there is no expectation I can blow you out of the water because you weren’t anticipating something fantastic and it came at you anyway. People were freaking out about Louise’s costumes but you don’t really think about what she’s wearing in the book. [Before the show] nobody gave St. Germain’s costumes a second thought. Then they were floored by them. [The fans said], “What a minute, what? A man wore that? Oh my God, imagine walking into a room wearing that!” The other thing [about designing costumes for an adaptation] is that you are making a show for readers and non-readers. With the red dress or the nipple dress, people who didn’t read the book are like, “Huh? Why is that there?” It’s a finely-cut thing.

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HB: Terry, can you walk me through the Season 2 finale? What were the challenges of going into the ’60s? What were you trying to convey with this older Claire?

TD: You should recognize the Claire we saw in Season 1, the Claire we saw in Season 2 and the Claire we see in Season 3. She should be recognizable. She cannot be this new person. It was really rewarding when viewers were going, “It’s still Claire!” They also had really powerful, emotional reactions to her costumes. People were telling me, “I cried when Claire came out with the blue robe because my mom had that robe.” Claire’s pajamas are my mother’s pajamas—literally. They’re made by Vanity Fair. They’re that nylon blue color we all know. You’re able to see Claire but you’re also kind of able to see yourself or someone you know. A lot of our audience is either Claire’s daughter or Claire. They are of that age. There’s a familiarity and there should always be. The beauty of the books for me were, “What would I do if I were in that circumstance?” So it’s about identifying with that character and trying to imagine myself in her situation. There has to be a sense of, “She’s familiar to me.” I love doing her clothes. I loved her clothes for the ’60s. I was going for Anne Bancroft.

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HB: Were there particular challenges that come with aging her 20 years?

TD: Ron and I had a big argument about this. He said, “People need to believe that she’s older.” And I go, “Clothes don’t do tricks. They’re not angry, they’re not taller, they’re not shorter.” It’s really about what the person is doing. I kept saying, “You’re going to see such a leap. It’s going to be such a shift to see this woman out of 18th century clothing and into the ’60s. Then you depend on a phenomenal actress like Caitriona Balfe to sell it.

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HB: We’re meeting Brianna for the first time. What did you want to say with her clothes?

TD: That was everything I ever wore when I was nine. My mother was a clothes horse. When I was nine I had a leather suit, a leather beret, a leather vest and jumper and knee-high leather boots. I remember all those outfits with tremendous love. So I translated that into Brianna. I had those corduroy pants and that pea coat and that cap. She’s listening to The Beatles and she’s looking at Carnaby Street. The British invasion is happening for her. We’re not doing Mad Men. Those million, brilliant costumes are New York on Fifth Avenue. Outlander is a different world. People are like, “You’re going to have fringe vests and paisley pants!” The majority of people didn’t wear that.

HB: What can you tell me about Season 3?

JGS: Well we’re in America, we’re in some Caribbean islands and we are also in Scotland—that’s the only set that plays more than one period. It’ll be there all three seasons. That set is still up, that’s the only set that’s been up that long. I don’t know if I should tell, but we’re building a huge Boston apartment. I’m excited about the look of Boston. And the print show is gonna be awesome. We had two real print presses made by a guy who makes replicas for museums. I’m trying to make it feel like one of the first factories, with a pre-industrial look to it. It’s gonna be awesome. I walked around through it last week. It’s a big set. There will be all kinds of fun stuff to keep everybody going. It’s a completely different look.

TD: It is a completely different show. This is a really good season for us because it’s almost like a transition, story-wise and it’s not hard on us. The beauty of a show about time travel is that it’s a show about time travel. We are bouncing back and forth right now between the ’60s and the 18th century. Right now I’m knee-deep in the ’60s. That’s so much fun. Just when you think you can’t see one more 18th century gown, you’re suddenly doing mini skirts. There’s a few surprises out there that are gonna excite a lot of people and piss a lot of people off. I can tell everybody that right now. And beyond those, it’s kind of a low-key season for us and then Season 4 is huge! Because we’ve been picked up for two seasons, we’ve put a lot of our focus on what’s going to be happening in 4. It took us a year to prep for Season 2 and it’s going to take a year to prep for Season 4. Season 4 will be another biggie.

HB: There are particular challenges for Season 3 for you, Terry. You have to deal with changing body types. Jamie’s been living in a cave for years!

TD: He’s living in a cave for several years and I don’t think anybody’s bringing in a new rack of clothing every week. We have different issues. We have issues of breakdown in aging—you gotta believe that everybody looks the way they’re supposed to, so we have a different set of challenges. It’s not going to be about building huge spectacular costumes like we did in Paris and it’s not like Scotland. It’s a new world and a new reality that we have to create and it’s already fantastic. We’ve barely started. We were out on set, we saw the first day of shooting and we were like, “OK, here we go again!” It’s a fascinating show that way.

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Outlander: Terry Discusses Keeping Track of All Those Pieces!

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By: Erin Conrad July 17, 2016

On Twitter this morning, Terry Dresbach showed fans a bit of what it takes to wrangle the tens of thousands of costume pieces Outlander has used in the past two seasons. All of the information and photos in this post are from Twitter. With a system that has been used by large costume rental houses, museums, and other facilities that house extensive collections, she put an RFID scan system in place to identify and track the pieces and their details, who has used them, and where they’re stored.

She said that as they start Season 3, about 30,000 pieces have had a bar code attached and been entered into the system, taking about 6 months. Going forward, all pieces will be entered into the system as they’re made (for Season 3, so far, though, only about 10 costumes have been created). The system was set up retroactively, however, because when the show started, the costume department only had a small space and a staff of about 8. Her staff now numbers about 70 people.

Terry says that she believes Outlander is the only show using a bar code system – she says there may be others, but she doesn’t know of any. But the huge number of individual pieces, many of which will likely be reused, made an organization system a necessity. The costume department now takes up about 20,000 square feet, including offices, workroom, storage, ageing and dyeing, fitting, fabric storage, drying (costumes get wet from filming outdoors) and more. Terry says the only comparison she can make is “to running the military. Dressing, feeding, transporting…” She said “it takes a year, and a village. This is not the local theater group.”

Costumes for extras are fit weeks before those people work, so that if shooting is done out of the Cumbernauld studios, everything is already organized before travel. Terry estimates that they have used hundreds of thousands of buttons, and have about 40,000 pieces (shoes, cuffs, jackets, etc), and outfit at least 5,000 extras per season. They make up to 6 copies of lead costumes!

The slideshow below gives you all of the basics, and some fantastic photos inside the costume storage area:

Would you like to have the chance to meet Terry – and Grant O’Rourke – in person?
Join us at Thru The Stones in December!

Follow me on Twitter: @OutlanderTIBS, @ErinConrad2 and @threeifbyspace
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Outlander Secrets, Part 11: The Costume Detail No One Notices
In the latest installment of Outlander Secrets, costume designer Terry Dresbach reveals just how much time goes into perfecting things we rarely even see.

JUN 17, 2016
Terry Dresbach talks a lot about the jaw-droppingly gorgeous, Emmy-winning costumes she crafts for the Starz megahit Outlander: the swan dress, the kilts, the Dior-inspired dress. But she doesn’t often get to wax poetic about the show’s shoes.

“The shoes are something I’ve been really really wanting to talk about, because they’re pretty spectacular,” Dresbach says. Here, we give her the floor to do just that. When you consider just how much time goes into every single detail of the show’s wardrobe—even the things we don’t usually see!—it’s truly mind-boggling.


“It works like this: There are the custom shoes I design for Caitriona Balfe [who plays Claire Fraser] that we had custom made, and there are the ones we make for our supporting cast, and then there’s the insane process of making shoes for thousands of extras. There are a lot of ’90s mules that have been repurposed. We’ve become masters of taking all sorts of odd shoes that we see on eBay and turning them inside out, taping them, putting ribbons and bows and glitter all over them, and suddenly we have 18th century shoes. It’s quite fascinating to watch.

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This season, we bought a lot of wedding shoes. Wedding shoes are a great resource. You know the ‘dye-your-own’ kind? Where it’s made to match the bouquet? We bought those and then we dye them. We start out by having them all dyed, then the next team comes in and paints them with stencils, and then the next team puts on the bows and the embellishments. We have boxes and boxes and boxes of very elaborate shoes that just started out as bad ’80s wedding shoes.


Ahh, the red shoes! You know, there are shoes and there are shoes. Those are shoes, and that is not part of the mass production. That is me taking advantage of the opportunity, for the first time in my career, to say, ‘Well, we’d obviously have to design these shoes. We can’t just go buy them.’

But it was fascinating process because I took actual 18th century shoes and just changed them a little bit. What I wanted to sell was the idea—like I have on so much of this show—that you really don’t have to reinvent history to make it fantastic, beautiful, sexy, glamorous. We’ve been revisiting the 18th century on the runway since Dior did it in the ’40s. Lagerfeld, Vivienne Westwood, Dior, Chanel, Marc Jacobs…is there a season where we’re not going back to the 18th century?

In the end the red shoes turned out wonderful. But I absolutely love all Claire’s shoes, like the ones she wears the Dior bar suit. For that I sort of did a riff on the black lace shoe with the pom pom on it that Dior did with that costume. She’s wearing 1940s Dior-inspired shoes as well, but you can’t see them.

I wish I could make all Claire’s skirts all much much shorter so we could see them! It’s all about whether or not they actually shoot them on camera. I’m always yelling at my husband [Outlander showrunner Ronald D. Moore], ‘You never see their shoes!’ and he’s all like, ‘Last week you were yelling at me about the back of their dress, and now this week, it’s shoes.’ And it’s like, ‘But do you know that we made those shoes? They’re beautiful; you need more shoe shots.'”

We agree.

This interview has been edited and condensed for clarity.

Want even more season two Outlander? Bookmark ELLE.com/OutlanderSecrets!

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It’s true.  I am still obsessed with the knitwear on Outlander.  Not just the main pieces either.  Yes, I love Claire’s cowls, caplets, and shawls, but even the supporting players and extras had beautiful pieces.  (click on an image to enlarge)

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I am sure it isn’t just me.  There are a lot of websites out there for patterns, both free and paid.  There are people selling premade replicas, and even LionBrand Yarn has gotten in on the act.

I was a little nervous about it, but the amount of love it has generated, the fact that there are women who are knitting all of these scarves and cowls based on our show is so touching and so lovely and speaks so much about our fans and who they are and the relationship they have to the material. It’s really quite lovely, and I don’t think twice about it anymore.  – Terry Dresbach

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Outlander Secrets, Part 10: The Big, Big Problem With Jamie’s Kilt
In the latest installment of Outlander Secrets, costume designer Terry Dresbach talks the most controversial element of the Scotland wardrobe.

JUN 10, 2016
Much has been written about the head-turning, high-wattage costumes from Outlander’s Paris scenes this season: the saturated colors, the meticulous embroidery, the jaw-dropping accessories (er, nipple jewelry). At this point in the Starz hit’s second season, Outlander protagonists Claire and Jamie have returned to Scotland, ditching Paris’ jewel-tone silks for Scotland’s utilitarian gray wools—but the chatter about the show’s costumes hasn’t slowed a bit. How could it, with Emmy-winning costume designer Terry Dresbach at the helm? Here, we chat with Dresbach about Outlander’s wardrobe now that we’ve returned to the Highlands, and the mind-boggling challenges the Scottish wardrobe presents.

The catch-22 with tartans:

“You know, it’s really interesting because the tartans are a very, very difficult issue. Because unless you have subtitles going across the bottom of the screen that explain history, you’re really having to deal with audience misconceptions that go back for decades. There’s a lot of scholarly debate about tartans, and I try to ride the line very, very carefully. I won’t say which group I believe, because then I’ll get 9 million angry letters, but…





There’s certainly a school of thought that says that tartans are actually something that was invented by the Victorians as sort of a romanticism of Scotland, that the clan tartans—and all those crazy colors—really isn’t accurate to the 18th century. But we do have a romantic association with, ‘Oh, I’m clan MacKenzie’ or ‘I’m clan Fraser.’ And certainly our book fans have that, but the research doesn’t support it. So my job is to figure out: How do I handle with care people’s love of a piece of the story and be accurate? Because either way I’m getting angry letters.

I still get letters from people going, ‘Why isn’t he wearing the Fraser tartan that I bought when I went to visit Edinburgh and went to that gift shop?'”

How she handled it:

“What I did was I tried to put myself in the head of somebody in the 18th century. So if I’m a weaver or a dyer or a fabric maker and I’m living in a little smoky hovel with three generations and maybe cow and pig in the corner, and it’s pouring rain outside all the time, how much time am I spending with that giant pot over the fireplace [dyeing fabric] getting the exact correct shade of lavender? Probably not a lot. But then enters Prince Charlie wearing his insane red plaid:

But that’s an actual reproduction of a painting that he had commissioned that he actually was out on the battlefield wearing that brilliant red plaid. It’s just something, isn’t it? [But that makes sense for the Prince to wear that because] dyes were incredibly, incredibly expensive!

But it just seemed to me like, historically, fabrics are created from the environment people live in. So what we did was research all the plant life in the area of our story and basically came up with: What colors would we be able to produce living where they lived? And then as we filmed we went, ‘Okay, the people in this village like this pattern, and the people in that village like this one.’ But they’re all in the same general geographic vicinity, which is why you see the colors being so similar but the patterns different. Claire will be wearing a different plaid than Jamie’s wearing and it’s different than what Dougal MacKenzie’s wearing, but gosh they look awfully similar.

…But unfortunately, you can’t send that letter out to every fan before they watch the show that this is what we’re doing.”

This interview had been edited and condensed for clarity.

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